Glenn, Actually I was able to REMOVE 6 porcelain veneers with the Waterlase. I am not sure that it “etches” porcelain, but I read the thread between you and the “other guy” and I have a old PFM just waiting tomorrow for me to try it on, and take a photo of for you. Let’s see if he’s right ok? I can’t honestly say I etched the porcelain, BUT the hydrokinetics, did fracture the porcelain and get underneath it to lift it safely and effectivly off the tooth, without doing ANY cutting of the underlying tooth structure. It was really cool, I show it in my lectures on Laser Veneers.
Mark

Here are the veneer cases, 2 pics, the crown I “etched” is coming, with explanation. I don’t think these etch, but Bob Gregg says that the water gets underneath the porcelain, and I believe that is what happens with the veneers. It creates small microfractures, then the porcelain just comes right off. The crown was different, and I will explain that one when I post it in a few minutes, I have another patient to go see!
Mark
[img]https://www.laserdentistryforum.com/attachments/upload/MVC-025F.JPG[/img][img]https://www.laserdentistryforum.com/attachments/upload/MVC-026F.JPG[/img]

Here is the second image. Sorry, it didn’t seem to upload the first time.
Mark

Quote: from 2thlaser on 3:47 pm on Nov. 18, 2002
Just so you know, I sacrificed a couple of tips on that crown!!!! When it arcs/sparks, usually that means the tip is gone, and voila, there it was! Sacrificed for the sake of Laser Dentistry!
Mark

Mark, you’re not the only one – I did a little arcing and sparking with mine on a PFM also.  After doing it though, I wondered why it surprised me a little, when after all I was directing the beam at something highly reflective.I’ve done the same thing removing old composite that had quartz in it so why would a PFM be different?

A primary ingredient in porcelain is Kaolinite which contains Aluminum.  From a U of Wisconsin site:

Kaolinite is a clay mineral with the chemical composition Al2Si2O5(OH)4. The basic building blocks are layers of silica tetrahedra (with four apical O) and layers of alumina octahedra (with two apical O shared with silica and four apical OH), in a 1:1 relationship. The unit cell (5.14 Å by 8.93 Å by 7.37 Å) repeats in the x and y directions to form extensive sheets in the xy plane and stacks of sheets in the z direction formed by hydrogen bonds (HO–H) between OH of the alumina of one sheet and O of the silica of the next.

Well, as being ‘the other guy’, I’ll chime in.  First, “HI EVERYBODY!!”

Glenn and I have spoken about this in emails.  As I told Glenn, I went to the office the next morning after our original discussion, all excited to cut some porcelain.  I got out a few broken PFM pieces that we had in the lab, and fired up the Waterlase.

No dice. NOTHING!!  Really pissed me off, because I KNEW that I’d used the Waterlase on porcelain before.  All were on chipped veneers except one 6-unit PFM bridge.

In fact, the fella with the bridge was in last Monday.  I took a look at where I’d repaired the chip.  He had originally broken off the corners of #6 MI and #7 DI that necessitated the repair in the first place.  I did not originally make this bridge.  The bridge is about 5 years old.  

The repair looks great, and like I said, I had repaired it after shaping and creating some mechanical retention with the Waterlase.

Frustrated that the Waterlase wouldn’t touch the PFMs I was trying it on, I called my lab to ask.  I really got no good info from the lab, but we discussed that it might be some sort of difference in the porcelains.  Hmmmm.

Anyway, thanks for the invite to join here Ron.  Maybe I can “hype” some lasers here too, huh?  LOL!!!

Rod

(Edited by Rod at 5:36 pm on Nov. 24, 2002)