Reliability Reports

[Anonymous]

Hi All,

Recently I received an offer by a 3rd party to act as a go between between dentists who are having mechanical problems with their laser and the company that manufactured the laser.

I have received feedback from dentists that believe that they are heard by sales people and some execs, but they believe the info is not getting to the engineers and designers where the problems could be corrected, not simply replaced.

As I understand the offer, his/her function would be to compile data and present the facts to the manufacturer making sure they are getting a true feeling for what is really going on in the real world , regarding reliability.
He/she has the connections to get the info to the designers/engineers.

This would also allow the laser user to speak out in a way w/o fear of what an individual company’s reaction toward them might be.

I think this person has offered a great service, but I’d like a little feedback from all. Yes or no is fine and you can even give suggestions in your response on how best to accomplish this.

Thanks,

[kellyjblodgettdmd]

I think this would potentially be beneficial. However, I would be concerned with what they would want from the laser user in return for this service. Or, would they simply make their money by charging the laser manufacturers for their information. Overall, I think such a company could add value to the communication between laser user and manufacturer.

Kelly

[Anonymous]

Kelly,

This would be no charge to anyone.

The source is interested in dental lasers for a variety of reasons, but does not own any lasers. He/she knows more laser physics than most of the dentists using lasers do, so he/she will know when tall tales are being told. He/she is not an employee of any laser company.

What we are thinking about is the setting up of a private email where users could explain their difficulties or giving the person a private name/identitiy on the forum which could be private messaged.

Thanks for the feedback.

Any other suggestions appreciated,

[Anonymous]

Ron,

I know that this would be a tremendous help to lasers in dentistry – if this person is for real and does not have some ulterior motive. years ago, we tried to tell the companies what we needed – we had no idea of the negative reaction we would get. Because the companies would not listen to us when we told them what we needed as clinicians is one of the reasons that we built our own laser. I really hope this works out!

[ASI]

Hi Ron,

This is an interesting concept.

Will the role of this person be something like this? It is like having a “laser ombudsman” or the “JD Power of dental lasers” to whom each laser user can report any experience regarding their particular unit. With the assurance that their concern will be forwarded to the appropriate maker, and the data collected will be made available for all users and potential users.

So that any problem a laser user has will not just be a private matter between the user and the maker, but for the entire industry to take notice of. In this way, the overall realiability and performance of all laser units will be improved.

No more hear says and questionable sales pitch tactics, but proven clinical performance, and repair and maintenace records to substantiate the claims by the maker. Thereby, raising the standard of the entire dental laser industry for the benefit of all, but more importantly for the advancement of broader laser application in dentistry. Sounds like an idealistic endeavor? I hope this happens.

Andrew

[dilbert]

Here is a list of proposed info to gather. Feedback appreciated.

brand
model
Purchase date
Has or will laser payout Yes/No
Training level
Total downtime since purchase
Number of failures since purchase
Last failure mode and date
Last service date
Service performed
Other comments

[Anonymous]

I think it would be best if you private message dilbert w/ the info.

[dilbert]

Thanks for clarifying Ron. I am still at the “what info to gather?” stage and have not given much thought to the reporting and disseminating process yet. The goal is to provide honest feedback to manufacturers without the fear of retaliation. At the same time, we won’t want this to become a forum for bashing or cheerleading companies although all comments will be archived for the manufacturers to review if they so choose.

The first step here is to gather ideas from laser users and potential users about what info they want.

[Anonymous]

Dilbert,

We look forward to a great collection of information.

[Swpmn]

First of all thanks to “Dilbert” and Ron for the proposal. Don’t know who “Dilbert” is but have an idea.

The laser companies already have this information. Logs are kept when technicians go out for a service call, records are kept showing what part has been replaced when, how many have been sent multiple times to a particular doctor, etc. The companies know what is going on in the field.

So, how come they don’t fix ’em? Couple of ideas:

1) Possible that certain components of certain lasers have inherent engineering designs which simply preclude the engineers from fixing the problem. Perhaps the part or mechanism which would correct the situation is patented by another company. Unless the engineers can redesign the laser from the ground up, they may not be able to fix the problem…….which leads to…

2) Maybe its gonna cost the company too much to fix the problem. If the company is publicly traded and needs to keep shareholders happy….well, you get the picture and this certainly isn’t my idea. If you would like to read a simply fascinating exchange, go back to the OFF TOPIC section of this forum and read “Laser Suppliers”.

Anyway, great idea you guys came up with and I’m ready to contribute. I would not mind posting the information on a public forum as I believe it would be more beneficial to dentists using lasers or considering a laser purchase.

Suggest you add a category something like:

Has any particular failure mode occured more than once and if so how many times and what was the mode of failure?

I do not understand the category:

Has or will laser payout Yes/No

Thank you very much,

Al

[BNelson]

It all sounds reasonable to me. As voiced by others, it is always nice to have the info on an open forum. Whether or not the manufacturers will listen is something that won’t be known until it is tried- So go for it.

[dilbert]

Swpmn:

>>I do not understand the category:
>>Has or will laser payout Yes/No

I thought it was important to know whether the equipment will pay for itself despite the problems. A manufacturer may think that it is the principal criteria for customer satisfaction when in fact it may not be, so they need to be told that. Users or potential users will also need to know how the frequency of downtime impacts their profitability. Perhaps the wording needs more explanation and I need to ask for more details under the category?

[Swpmn]

Thanks for the clarification, Dilbert.

How about:

Has or will the laser pay for itself? Y/N

Al

[dilbert]

Ok.  Below is the info we want to gather based upon the feedback.  Please go ahead and send your answers via the message icon and I will start compiling the records.

brand
model
Purchase date
Has or will laser pay for itself  Y/N
Training level
Total non-scheduled downtime since purchase
Number of failures since purchase
Last failure mode and date
Last service date
Service performed
Has any particular failure mode repeated and if so how many times and what was the mode of failure?

Other comments

If you happen to have mulitple brands of systems, please make a note in your comments.

We also want to compile data on your flawless lasers so send in reports even if you have had 99.9% uptime.

Thanks for contributing.

(Edited by dilbert at 11:06 pm on June 2, 2003)

[dilbert]

As of June 2, 2003. I have a grand total of 1 person reporting his/her experience. I will post charts when there is sufficient info to make pie and bar charts.

[Author]

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